Our Ref: BR2/8/2
TO ALL AVANTI WEST COAST CATERING GRADES
10th October 2024
Dear RMT Member,
ROSTERING ISSUES, CATERING GRADES – AVANTI WEST COAST
Please find below a message from your Lead Officer Craig Johnston:
“To update members on where we are.
Firstly, this is indeed a strange dispute because I have asked myself if nothing has changed since the agreements made with Virgin Trains the why is the issue of STP/LTP diagrams, rostering arrangements and compulsory overtime at Liverpool and Holyhead became so controversial?
Something has clearly changed since Virgin operated this franchise and we believe it is management interpretation of agreements, sometimes ignoring agreements or denying they even are agreements - or deliberately picking and choosing what best applies for them.
Throughout all of this the catering company council and the Lead Organiser have simply wanted to ensure some key things …
1. That staff have stability and certainty of what time they are starting and finishing work - with the required notification.
2. That when an LTP diagram is replaced with an STP diagram it is done for the right reasons - e.g., there are timetable changes due to engineering work usually around bank holidays.
This is important because at the moment the company can move catering staff two hours from their original booking on times - whilst that’s bad enough - we should also state that there’s some evidence that they cancel LTP turns and replace them with STP for any reason they like - driver shortages, stock movements etc. I would also point out that the two-hour movement for catering grades doesn’t actually exist in any written agreement I have seen! So, some would say the increased level of flexibility they are using and sometimes abusing … they don’t even have in a documented agreement.
3. Sometimes with the slightest alteration to a diagram - replacing an LTP with an STP - staff are moved off their rostered jobs and subjected to a potential two-hour movement - this could be down to a change of platform or stopping pattern - that seems extreme to throw people off their booked diagram because it has only slightly changed. So, we are looking at how to overcome that issue and we have some ideas we are exploring. One of these ideas is to accept overtime of up to 10 minutes and if that fits with the alteration to a diagram staff would be able to stay with their work - perhaps working an extra ten minutes as a maximum but then NOT been taken off their original job or being subjected to the two-hour movement.
4. The company are already saying that if there is no change to the booking on or off times staff would automatically remain with their turn (even if the contents are amended somewhat) - We would want to formalise that arrangement.
5. There is an argument too about DAS - Daily Appearance Sheets - these are posted and, in our opinion, should finally show what staff are booked to work - if there’s any change to their work schedules etc. - we believe once posted they should be final … the company is saying that late applications for leave and sickness etc. mean they can’t always be final - if that’s the case what’s the point of them? There has to be a cut off time when the company accepts it cannot change people’s booking on and off times.
6. We also asked for finishing times to be shown on DAS apparently, they weren’t able to do that, but we are pushing for a system that shows people what time they are booked to finish (obviously nit including on the day disruption).
There are some other technical points we are looking at, but we will now try to deal with some of the specific questions that have been raised with us:
Q. We received info that us caterers to be balloted AGAIN re STPs, we had a mandate in place which we personally feel wasn't used to make any sort of impact.
Our Response – We are interested to know how you feel we could have increased the impact - we accept we don’t always get things right, so genuinely if you have ideas let us know.
Q. We feel that we are going round in circles and getting no information about what's being discussed at meetings with union and company
Our Response - there haven’t been that many meetings and, as is the nature of these discussions, sometimes we explore solutions without anything actually coming to fruition. Keeping staff advised is important but we do need more definite information to give to people. No minutes have been supplied from Dispute meetings for us to share.
Q. When we ask, we get told it's too complicated and will be sent a simple version of what company wants, info was never given.
Our Response - It’s not really about what the company wants, it’s what the company is doing in terms of breaching agreements, being selective about which agreements apply, enforcing things that are NOT in any agreements and misinterpreting other agreements - we want them to stop doing this with the development of a new agreement that yes gives them some flexibility but also gives our catering members some stability and certainty.
We want a better work / Life balance for our people.
In the last 2 years staff have had little stability in rosters due to company approach – meaning rosters that run are constantly changed in particular at weekends.
Q. I'm also curious as to why Liverpool and Holyhead have a 3-hour movement when spare, how and why was this agreed? Why was this agreed in the first place?
Our Response - this was apparently a local agreement from many years ago - it’s a two hour movement and an additional hours overtime -(although the two hour movement isn’t documented as we said before) it’s a terrible agreement and there is no documentation that we have seen as to why it was made - one suggestion is it was made to deal with a specific engineering blockade and management have abused it – the agreement is very old and getting to the bottom of what happened at the time it was made is very challenging.
This agreement was made for Bank holidays & engineering; however the company will not allow it to be rescinded, and have abused it 7 days a week.
Q. (At local level) how is it now a national dispute for them?
Our Response - it has always been the case that national agreements supersede local agreements - there is no national agreement for the extra hours overtime so it can’t apply - although management enforce it.
The STPs and how they are being used affect everyone, some depots more than others.
Q. Must have suited the 2 depots at the time otherwise it would not have been agreed.
Our Response - I cannot really add much more information to the answer above - sometimes (in good faith) reps have allowed amendments to national agreements to assist the company over a particular problem - like an engineering blockade - but these are usually time limited because (as I have said above) national agreements supersede - or are more appropriate - than a local arrangement.
This agreement was intended for use on Bank holidays & engineering. Worth noting the Colin Smith 2019 agreement (contained in diagram compendium) supersedes that local agreement.
Q. What did those depots gain out of the increase in spare movement because I know it would never have been agreed if they were not to gain something out of it.
Our Response - As far as I can see they gained absolutely nothing - there is certainly no differences in terms of enhancements recorded anywhere.
They did not gain anything & have not been allowed to rescind it.
Q. We are being asked to take strike action for stuff we know nothing about.
Our Response - at the moment there is no strike action planned - we have to re-ballot under the Tories anti trades union laws - there are some management proposals that have been put to us but they still leave some matters unresolved - the Union national executive has called the catering company council down to London next Thursday in an attempt to go through what’s potentially agreed and what isn’t.
If we can make progress, then we are likely to have a trial of any new arrangements and if it’s successful we would likely then ballot our members on any new agreement - BUT WE ARE NOT THERE YET there is still work to do and issues to resolve - it’s important that whilst we negotiate our members give us a yes vote in the re-ballot to keep pressure on the company.
There was a national call all staff were invited to, and reps in each depot should be able to answer the queries/questions.
Q. I think throughout the full company that the union will struggle to get a YES majority.
Our Response - We are a member led Union and we will always respect the members decisions on these matters, however if we don’t win this ballot it will be business as usual from AWC changing staffs booking on and off times, misinterpreting LTP/STP agreements and continue ruining the work/life balance for staff.
Our hope is that we will get a deal - there are still issues to iron out but if we get over those and have a trial and its successful, we can then ballot our members on a new agreement that works for them - better situation than we have now.
The strike re-ballot is simply to keep up the pressure … if we lose the ballot the pressure on the company will ease and with it the pressure to get an agreement.”
Ballot papers have now been dispatched. It is imperative that we stand together and demonstrate our strength of feeling to the company. It is vital that we get a massive return in the ballot for industrial action, so we are not prevented from acting on our members' wishes by the ballot thresholds. Failure to meet these thresholds means industrial action cannot happen, so a high turnout is crucial.
The ballot for industrial action will close on Thursday 24th October 2024. Make sure you return your ballot paper well before the closing date.
I urge members not to waste their vote and to vote 'YES' for strike action and industrial action short of a strike.
Do not allow the company to win by hiding behind anti-trade union legislation. We must send the company a clear message that we will take this principled stand and we will not allow them to run away from negotiating a fair deal. It is time for management to get around the table and come to a sensible agreement.
Make sure you return your paper as soon as you receive it. If you do not receive your voting paper by Tuesday 15th October 2024 or know of a colleague who has not received it, please e-mail info@rmt.org.uk; alternately you can call the freephone helpline on 0800 376 3706, RMT Head Office on 0207 387 4771 to request a replacement.
I trust this keeps you advised.
Yours sincerely
Michael Lynch
General Secretary
Unity House
Tel: 020 7387 4771
Email: